Piotr

Paint.net will never replace Paint in XP

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Paint in XP is just a lot better than paint.net.

 

1. New image is always in 800x600, and to make matters worse, in 99% size. In Paint, it was in last set size.

2. Eraser is always transparent. In Paint, you can select any background color to erase, and the eraser is square. Eraser in Paint is a convenient option to both enlarge drawing size and use background color instead of text color. Right-clicking with eraser in Paint will replace text color with background color.

3. Paint.net shows the color circle behind the "More >>", and no RGB sliders or text boxes. That is strange and should not exist. It should have been done like this:

mBbHtVs.png

And not like this:

uJwjlzQ.png

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Actually, this gives me an idea for the paintbrush/eraser tool!

 

Would it be possible to assign actual shapes to the Paint brush and eraser tool? Like uh, all of the shapes already there? So for example you could have a square shaped eraser like in MS Paint and any other shape that is already in PDN. 

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Improvements to brushes are in the plans, hopefully for this summer.

 

From a technical standpoint, yes it would be straightforward to utilize the existing shapes system for brushes.

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3 hours ago, Piotr said:

and no RGB sliders or text boxes.

 

That's your weird color scheme rendering the controls the same color as the background.

 

3 hours ago, Piotr said:

Eraser is always transparent. In Paint, you can select any background color to erase,

 

That's the way Erasers work. If you select the background color with the magic wand you can press delete to remove it.

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6 hours ago, Ego Eram Reputo said:

 

That's your weird color scheme rendering the controls the same color as the background.

 

 

That's the way Erasers work. If you select the background color with the magic wand you can press delete to remove it.

How is my color scheme weird? What do you mean by "controls"?

 

On a red paper, erasers turn pencil drawings red. They don't somehow remove the red color of paper. Please allow erasers to be what they were in Paint, and not remove the "any color feature" and square color, and snapping to grid lines with eraser.

 

Also note that this topic was posted on edge of my sleeping time. Here is the continuation:

 

4. There are no convenient resizing. Paint had only three (bottom, bottom right, right) but it's better than nothing.

5. Both programs have issue that the starting image (secondary color/background color) is always white, and primary color/text color is always black instead of allowing to choose default colors.

6. Text tool is blurry; it doesn't use standard text rendering and doesn't allow bitmap fonts.

7. For compatibility, it's ideal to add GDI32.dll drawing of lines and ellipses, and therefore also drawing shapes for circles used in Paint in XP. It's really different, there are a lot of different ways you can draw a 10x10 circle for example.

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3 minutes ago, Piotr said:

On a red paper, erasers turn pencil drawings red. They don't somehow remove the red color of paper. Please allow erasers to be what they were in Paint, and not remove the "any color feature" and square color, and snapping to grid lines with eraser.

 

Hello?? We're working on a monitor, not paper. Digital erasers erase pixels.

 

4 minutes ago, Piotr said:

4. There are no convenient resizing. Paint had only three (bottom, bottom right, right) but it's better than nothing.

 

Ctrl + A, press M drag the corner nubs. Easy when you know how isn't it?

 

 

 

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@Piotr

I don't think Paint.NET was created to replace any other program. :/

I did made a comparison in the past with other programs in terms of difficulty of use (and with other programs I've tried out recently, like Artweaver and Paint Tool Sai.) And I've learned something else: each program was created with a different approach and with an idea in mind.

If the canvas is always 800 x 600 (and in 99% size), it might be because not everyone has a computer with a huge resolution.

If the eraser is transparent, it's because of layers, which tend to be transparent. Also, there's a recoloring tool ( :RecoloringTool: ), which has the same purpose as the MS Paint's recoloring trick with the eraser.

If the color box was made like that, it might be to have more space for the canvas. So, doing it like the way you've demonstrated may clutter the workspace.

I only write as a person who's been on the look-out for programs to use for illustration; not as a programmer (or is it developer? O.o) since I can't do that to save my life. :lol: And I've found in Paint.NET a great ally to achieve what I want with creating illustrations. I hope you manage to find or found a program that suits your needs. :)

 

A little extra: MS Paint and Paint.NET are not the same. Just to let you know. :]

Edited by Beta0
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How many plugins can you use with paint?

And if you love XP Paint so much - why did Microsoft change it in WIN10? No more color wheel.

Looks like you will be on XP for a long time @Piotr

 

 

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I will try to respond objectively.

 

1 hour ago, Piotr said:

How is my color scheme weird? What do you mean by "controls"?

A "control" is a Graphical User Interface object. For example: Buttons, CheckBoxes, DropDowns, ect.

You may know "controls" by other names like "widgets" or "chrome elements".

 

1 hour ago, Piotr said:

On a red paper, erasers turn pencil drawings red. They don't somehow remove the red color of paper.

Indeed. However, in a digital image, your "red paper" and your "pencil marking" should be on separate layers. Thus, when you erase the "pencil markings", they will, in effect, turn red.

 

Layers and other arguments aside, I doubt anyone else would want the easer tool to function the way you have described. It sounds awful, and would no doubt confuse beginners.

 

1 hour ago, Piotr said:

Both programs have issue that the starting image (secondary color/background color) is always white, and primary color/text color is always black instead of allowing to choose default colors.

True, but 90% of the time (give or take) you're going to be changing those two colors anyways; regardless of the defaults.

 

1 hour ago, Piotr said:

Text tool is blurry

Is it? Perhaps your settings are not ideal. When I use the Text tool, the text is very readable and crisp.

 

1 hour ago, Piotr said:

... it doesn't use standard text rendering and doesn't allow bitmap fonts

Paint.net uses DirectWrite. DirectWrite actually is the standard text rendering in Windows, and has been for the past several versions of Windows.

 

I'm surprised people still care about Bitmap fonts, they're so antiquated and inferior.

 

1 hour ago, Piotr said:

For compatibility, it's ideal to add GDI32.dll drawing of lines and ellipses,

There are plenty of plugins available that use GDI+ to draw shapes; including but not limited to lines and ellipses.

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" If the color box was made like that, it might be to have more space for the canvas. So, doing it like the way you've demonstrated may clutter the workspace. "

No. The third window of what it should look like is an extra feature that allows people to have custom palettes, with custom sizes. This image demonstrates 18x16 setting for large palette.

 

I use Windows 10. The Paint in XP is simply an .exe file that can run on Windows 10. The reason I don't like Paint in 7 is that it has a different palette.

 

No! The eraser from Paint will not confuse beginners. In fact, it would be intuitive that background color is the color for erase. Also I don't like layers. I want to be able to do simple things without using complex features, like layers.

 

And what you said doesn't change the fact that I want different defaults. Black on white is definitely not the most common color scheme I want.

 

Then how will you explain this?

DjQrx3B.png

Paint in XP uses the same text engine as Notepad, and renders the same text. Paint.net?

But the thing is that I have a bitmap font called Custom Font that you see on my window titles. And I can't convert it to vector easily because it will be ugly if you were to use it in a size, say, 1 pixel more than bitmap height. Paint in XP allowed bitmap fonts, so why won't Paint.net?

 

Always having 800x600 in 99% size is different behavior than having last set size in 100% size.

 

Ctrl + A, press M drag the corner nubs doesn't work because it doesn't change canvas size and it resizes instead of cropping, like Paint does when you resize.

Edited by Piotr

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Clearly you prefer to use Paint over paint.net, so just use Paint. ;)

 

Paint.net is different, by design.  You have eccentric tastes; as such, you will find few here (if any) that agree with you.

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That's right, I prefer Paint. The only reason I still have paint.net is because of its circle tool, generating identical results as my implementation: https://scratch.mit.edu/projects/137683607/ but in an image.

Why this circle tool is special? It's because it correctly includes pixels inside a radius, and excludes pixels outside a radius. My implementation allows players to adjust radius (0 to 10 tolerance is -0.5 to 0.5 radius).

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You don't like layers, and you don't like paint.net.

 

:roll:

Why are you even posting here Piotr? No one is forcing you to use paint.net. In fact you downloaded it for free. Uninstall it and use Paint if it makes you that unhappy.

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To use a system that is designed to function in a certain manner, and compare it to another system that is designed differently, all the while complaining that each system is different, seems to make ones basic argument both moot and illogical.  It would seem to be a less stressful use of time to celebrate the differences, using each program for its strengths  and not trying to advocate a change for some esoteric use. 

 

But then I don't understand how come India Ink is used in drafting pens and calligraphy ink, isn't?my2cents.gif.6632fa5f23a8edbc5d2695d3afc4abe0.gif
 

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imo, m'h'o, mspaint could never replace paintdotnet. I use pdn with/in conjunction Graphics Work Shop Pro (Alchemy), copy paste from either to other, GWSP has a 'use mspaint' which I use, rarely tho, not much since PDN.

 

I use an older version under XP Pro (32 & 64) & actually prefer it to newer version(s) working on my 7 computer. (dont like the 'pictures')

 I prefer PDN to every other grafix program I have tried, , , , ,

 

-c-

 

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Apparently Microsoft is nice to me, at least at some point in time.

The Paint in XP is the best to me, but the XP itself was bad. Windows 7 was even worse, so glad I have Windows 10. I'm using Paint in XP when I want to draw a png picture. Don't ask me why, these are my opinions.

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Well, you're wrong here and I think, that you know this. So please troll some other guys in the net.

Edited by IRON67

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Well IMHO, the zooming option in XPs Paint is terrible. I prefer the Windows 7 Paint because it has a zoom slider at the bottom right and the ribbon interface works in it for me. Plus there are more fun shapes, brush styles and fill options. In fact, I have gained some skill with Windows 7's Paint and have made a video of it.

 

 

If you watch the whole video, I was able to achieve quite some tricks with it. There is another trick I have discovered with Windows 7's Paint that was not on the video and that I haven't yet publicly shown.

 

But few months later after I made that video, I was challenged to start using layers so that's when I started really toying with Paint.NET and discovered the wonderful world of using layers and plugins that were otherwise not possible to do on MS Paint (where some work required me to use two Paint windows). That made my life easier and my projects more neat and complex. Another drawback if I haven't made the move is that any of Microsoft's Paint versions don't have the API (application programming interface) to expand its current features or abilities such as plugins that you can install on programs like Photoshop, GIMP and Paint.NET.

 

And I was glad that I opened my mind to other possibilities. I thought I was some sort of MS Paint guru but putting that against a skilled Paint.NET user, its a far cry. Excellent art is still very possible for MS Paint and anyone can still freely choose this above others but in terms of effects and tools that distort and modify objects to make it look like something else, Paint.NET wins by a margin.

 

I guess we are all entitled to what we believe of how our work should be done but its another thing entirely to insist that our belief should correspond to what others think when they have found debatable solutions that are easier and more effective to them. And its rather healthier if we are all learners in our stance and open to new ideas than be entitled with a feeling of ascendancy to impose upon other people's preference.

 

Good luck.

 

 

 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Rick Brewster said:

I am very confused by this thread

 

Piotr has a history of trolling the PdN forum. He likes to compare paint.net to other tools (always in their favor) and post links to tutorials and plugins for other tools.

 

I haven't banned him yet, but I have warned him.

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