DPI / file issue

[Frustrated_newbee]

If someone could please help; I've tried searching, but haven't found anything that seems the same issue.

I need my output document to be 200dpi at 2200x3000px.

I create a new document File, New.  In the specs, I make it 2200x3000px at 200ppi (11x15")

I then create my stuff in various layers.

I Save As and choose bit depth at auto detect and click okay. (Saved as transparent .png file)

I upload my saved file to an online place and when the other party opens it, it says it is only 72 dpi and that it is not the right inch size either.

Can anyone help me figure out what I'm doing wrong please?

[toe_head2001]

8 minutes ago, Frustrated_newbee said:

I upload my saved file to an online place

 

I'm guess the upload service is modifying your image; that's not uncommon.

I suggest Zipping your PNG file, and then upload the zip file instead. That should prevent the PNG from being modified.

[Frustrated_newbee]

I have been suggesting that to them as I am unable to upload anything other than a .jpg or .png (but need this for transparency) and they are telling me no one else has this problem that is using Paint.net

[Ego Eram Reputo]

Ignore the DPI. This is a printer specific parameter which you don't need to bother with.

 

Just submit a PNG image 2200x3000px in size and you'll be fine. Trust me 😀

[HyReZ]

Make sure that your PNG file is being saved to 32 bit color to maintain transparency and maximum of colors!
At 24 bit color you will save your level of colors but lose transparency.
At 8 bit color you 'may' lower number of colors and some transparency.
In 4 bit color you will lose both.

If your background turns from a checker board to white after Paint.NET prepares your image for saving, you have lost transparency!
 

BTW:
I use the early Windows standard for monitors of 96 PPI when I make my Paint.NET canvases. I save may Paint.NET work; first as PDN files, and then as TIF. I will convert to JPG if the work is to be presented on the Internet.

 

 

Edited November 12, 2019 by HyReZ
to add more nfo / correcting errors

[Frustrated_newbee]

20 hours ago, Ego Eram Reputo said:

Ignore the DPI. This is a printer specific parameter which you don't need to bother with.

 

Just submit a PNG image 2200x3000px in size and you'll be fine. Trust me 😀

But they are telling me it matters because the image is much smaller than it is supposed to be.  They are printing it.

[Ego Eram Reputo]

The image size you quoted (11*15) at 200dpi is 2200*3000 pixels. Which is what you have.

 

Confirm with them the DPI they are printing at matches your quoted 200dpi. 200 does sound slightly low. 300+ would be more usual.

 

[HyReZ]

Ego Eram Reputo is correct. PPI and DPI are not the same thing. Most of the canvases that I create in PDN are 5000 x 5000 px at a resolution of 96 PPI. At that resolution the image would print nicely to 52 x 52 inch paper. If I created the the canvas as 5000 x 5000 px at a resolution of 300 PPI it would print to an image size of ~ 17 x 17 inches. In both instances the image is 5000 x 5000 px.

 

Consider this; the camera in my cell phone outputs to 18.7 MP (4992 x 3744 px), but the CMOS image sensor is only about a half inch square, but prints to poster size.

 

Resolution deals with the image in pixels, while DPI is the size of drops of ink on a surface. 

Edited November 12, 2019 by HyReZ

[Frustrated_newbee]

I know, that is why I don't know how to explain this.  I create the file here and it's fine.  I upload it to them and they open it and it's a different resolution and image size.  They say that I am the only one this is happening with, that users there create a file and upload a paint.net file done the same way and it comes out right.  They are trying to tell me my "computer" is doing something to the file and I believe their "uploading" system is converting it.  But I don't know how to prove this to them.  I've given them screenshots of my settings on the files themselves.

[toe_head2001]

29 minutes ago, Frustrated_newbee said:

But I don't know how to prove this to them. 

 

Have you proved it to yourself? Did you inspect the image file after saving it in Paint.NET?

 

Anyways, just tell them to change the DPI metadata on the image themselves. The image is already at the correct resolution (according to you).

If they are hassling you about something so easy for them to change, you should just fire them and work with another party.

[HyReZ]

Here is a link to a true 24 bit color image file:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e9/16777216colors.png

It is 4096 x 4096 pixels.
If opened in Paint.NET it is 96 DPI
If opened in Krita it is 72 DPI
If opened in Windows Paint it is 120 DPI
It is the same image, so which is correct?
The answer is that it does not matter until you print it to your desired dimensions!

BTW:
I have my works printed at our new local Fastsigns .

I work directly with printing staff there.
They have done excellent work on 'all' of my print projects from 13 x 19 inches up to 4 x 8 feet!

Edited November 12, 2019 by HyReZ

[Frustrated_newbee]

Okay, so that makes some sense to me (meaning I can comprehend it.)  But also makes me want to change my question slightly.

 

The final result of this is they take my image and print it onto a garment.  They are saying my DPI not being correct is the reason why images are not printing the correct size (coming out small on the shirt.  E.g.  If a baby onesie has a 6" wide set print area, my image comes out 3" wide on the product.)  If the DPI is not changing the pixel size (2200x3000px)/physical size (11x15") that it was saved as, what possibly could?

[Eli]

Where are you hosting your image? perhaps the host is changing the DPI and the size and when your printer downloads it, it is no longer the same file that you uploaded.

[Frustrated_newbee]

I upload it to their server.

[HyReZ]

Although this problem has little to do with Paint.NET I will offer this analogy as possible help to your understanding.

Think of your image as 35 mm film transparency. It has a specific dimension ( 36×24 mm with an aspect ratio of 3:2).
If I put the slide in a projector and project it onto a screen; the projection will be larger or smaller by using a zoom feature (or by adjusting the distance from the screen.)
In my analogy the projector represents the printer. 
My point is that the dimension of the slide can remain constant while the size of the projection can be adjusted by the operator.

If you feel that you need adjustments to your image simply double your image dimensions from 2200 x 3000 px to 4400 x 6000 px.

Edited November 13, 2019 by HyReZ

[Frustrated_newbee]

42 minutes ago, HyReZ said:

Although this problem has little to do with Paint.NET I will offer this analogy as possible help to your understanding.

Think of your image as 35 mm film transparency. It has a specific dimension ( 36×24 mm with an aspect ratio of 3:2).
If I put the slide in a projector and project it onto a screen; the projection will be larger or smaller by using a zoom feature (or by adjusting the distance from the screen.)
In my analogy the projector represents the printer. 
My point is that the dimension of the slide can remain constant while the size of the projection can be adjusted by the operator.

If you feel that you need adjustments to your image simply double your image dimensions from 2200 x 3000 px to 4400 x 6000 px.

Thank you.  I will try that and see if it makes a difference for them.  I'll have to figure out the percentage though as it's not exactly a 50% difference kind of thing.

 

And I appreciate the comments and feedback.  It's been very frustrating and I didn't think/was hoping it wasn't a program problem either, but trying to explain that to the end user is where my problem lay.  Thank you for your time, everyone.

[HyReZ]

The point is that you should not have to make any adjustments. Any adjustments should made by the printing company.
Some staff of printing companies are weak in their craft and are not masters of their equipment.
Some of notions held by the staff people date back to information from the days of offset printing that used halftone lines and dots.

Today's printers have its own print drivers and often come with great printing software that is independent of the app that created the image.
 

They use sRGB and not CYMK. If you select a dimension for the image it calculates the DPI to print that image so that it will be pleasing.
In fact large images such as highway bill boards may be printed at 6 DPI since they are viewed from far away. (larger dots but greater viewing distance) Small images like most photo graphs are viewed from up close need the a higher DPI than a posters that are viewed from several feet away.

 

For monitors its PPI.  A smartphone has more Pixels Per Inch than an 80 inch TV set.

These are my favorite links on subject of DPI vs PPI:

PPI vs DPI - Explained Properly (at last!)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8S2cnZ2QR70

dpi (Dots per inch) Explained
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=feGjpHXBAYc

Understanding Resolution; PPI, DPI for Print and Digital | PhotoJoseph’s Photo Moment 2017-02-28
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QveT_6BQ72o

Myths #001 Do I need 300dpi?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33lWbu-m0Ew

Image Size and Resolution Explained
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jp2Q2g0A5wc

Pixel Density, Demystified
https://vimeo.com/169809377
 

Edited November 13, 2019 by HyReZ